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**Looking for advice**
So basically I am an undergrad student finishing this year, and I have interviewed for internships for several large quant firms and made second last / final rounds for a lot of them but couldn't convert (Jane Street, Optiver, Citadel, Flow Traders etc). I am now up for an Energy Trading role and am wondering how difficult/ is it possible for me to pivot from energy trading into quant trading role at said HFT firms?

**TLDR: Can I pivot from Energy Trading into HFT Quant Trading as a grad trader?**

Seeking Advice: HFT Roles for Physics PhD with FPGA/Low-Latency ML Experience

If there is a public fact sheet you can find, you are probably looking at a mutual fund or some other long-only strategy. I think they are required to provide certain metrics, even though they don't necessarily apply to the strategy they are running. For example, the Sharpe ratio isn't the best to judge a benchmark tracking strategy. Sometimes strategies are not assigned the best benchmark. I don't know the exactly how that is determined, but the manager isn't free to select any benchmark he wants (ex: you can't say your goal is to track the Russell Small Cap Value benchmark when all your holdings are Large Cap).
Within the long-only world, hundreds of millions of dollars is nothing. Usually isn't enough to keep the fund running in the long run because fees are under 1%. That probably won't be enough to pay salaries and costs.
This subreddit focuses too much on HFT, stat arb, market making, and trading. Most of the finance world is long-only and you don't see very high Sharpe ratios.

Yes, they use quantitative models to automate trading. They also were found to have committed tax avoidance.
No one here is competing with them, as RenTec uses HFT and other short term methodologies and Value is 100% not that. If everyone was competing with them, EMH would be true and all companies would trade at intrinsic value at all times. This is not the case.

I don't think any retail are supporting Jane Street. However, they have genuine questions.. why just Jane Street and not Millennium, both used same strategy? Now, SEBI has ceased assets and keep collecting taxes from us.. how will they compensate those people who lost their hard earned money due to these manipulation. How will they ensure that these illegal activities on name of HFT or alpha/ beta/ theta algorithmic trading strategy will not be repeated?

Mehr oder weniger ein trading bot entwickler / researcher. Die ganzen HFT firmen sitzen halt alle in London und amsterdam

Does one need IIT education to do such simple 1000 Crore sells and buys using US capital and Chinese firm which is not allowed in US markets. There is no rocket science here. Just basket sell or buy 1000s of crores at particular time. what algorithm is required for this. This is not even HFT.

Should IIT , Jane Street and all other following its footsteps be booked for defrauding crores of traders and arrested, confiscated and accounts who have lost should be returned their rightful hard earned money which they have scammed to 2024 September level before Trump elections after which THEY STARTED IT EVEN AT LARGE SCALE.
* **Pravar Kataria:** A third-year Computer Science student at IIT Delhi, who interned as a quantitative trader at Jane Street. 
* **Aditya C:** A graduate of IIT Madras, who worked as a quantitative trader at Jane Street. 
* **Ravi Gupta:** A student from IIT Madras who received a high-paying PPO from Jane Street. 
* **Ashwin Goyal/Pranav Goyal / Pranshu Goyal :** All IIT Bombay students who shared his positive experience interning at Jane Street on Insight IIT Bombay. 
* **Archit Rungta:** A former IIT student who joined Jane Street as a Software Engineer. 
* **Kalash Gupta:** Jane Street SAR · Jane StreetExperience: *Jane Street* · Education: Indian Institute of Technology, Delhi
* 7. Citadel 8. Jump trading
* 6.Hudson River Trading
* 5. Qube Research
* 4.Millennium Management
* 3.WorldQuant
* 2. Tower Research
* 1. Graviton Research

Prevent yourself guys. Stop trading futures and options.
After looking at this jane street saga, you should realize that you are gambling at casino who has rigged the cards in their favor. Not only they have edge in terms of latency and faster order execution, now they are blatantly rigging the market and taking your money.
How did sebi took 2 years to catch them and they get slap on wrist? In US for HFT, they have very strong laws against market manipulation which include jail time. India is such a joke. Note that these laws are for protection of retail investors. So theifs came, they took your money, returned 10 percent of loot and left india. Sounds familiar enough? Britishers did this before literally and now they are doing like this. Pretty sure corrupt indians are also involved in this scam. No way pump and dump goes without being noticed.
Not only india got scammed, the regular people of india were scammed. Many people commit suicide because of losses and this is why they have losses because game is rigged.
My advice is to stay away from f/o in india. If you still want to trade options, i will recommend to stay disciplined and sell calls(need to own stock) or sell puts(need to have enough money). Anything else is gambling.
Remember money makes money. Protect yourself

thank you for the thorough analysis, i've been in the current SWE role for a little more than a year (blend of what you mentioned in number 1 + a optimization workflows, risk decomposition etc, developing workflows and features for PMs and financial advisors but not directly involved in investment at all).
Did you mean "quant dev" by number 2? in that case the answer is no, that's not what I currently am.
For context, i'm also not looking for HFT, low-latency etc, i'm more interested in longer time horizons signal research, (which I think is more institutional buy-side?). I am happy moving internally for now, but eventually like to move to places such as BW.
And finally, the PM role is a lateral / internal move.

Yes thanks for the 1bps price improvement after every HFT MM has run the price up 100bps

It is definitely not just for institutional traders. There are bots and EAs that do HFT. There are prop firms that also allow HFT. Some shut down because they can't sustain that model with that many traders being profitable, but that just shows that they weren't meant to last. They didn't start with the correct business model.
As a discretionary technical trader, I came across a few bots in my search for the indicators that would make up my "end all be all" strategy. I even saw a YouTube channel for such bots and displayed it in action.
Going through my bookmarks, I only found Paramour Godfather EA and doing a YouTube search for it, one of the channels that popped up was the EA Profit Zone. Hope this helps start you on your way.

There’s a report done by the CFTC titled “Risk and Return in High Frequency Trading” which discusses the performance of different styles of HFTs and how they perform relative to the market. Unsurprisingly the median HFT shop beats the market substantially.

Lmao...this is literally the textbook definition of 'market manipulation' there was no play of HFT strategy or shet, HFT's have been present here since more than a decade, they simply took unfair advantage of a developing market, I dare they try replicating the same in a developed market like US, UK, japan, etc., with near perfect liquidity and arbitrary mechanism, understand we are not a developed market as of now, nowhere near it.
Elon musk has enough net worth to buy whole as# countries, doesn't mean he can do it, having extra money in your pocket doesn't grant you a licence to do anything you want.

Setup a consulting firm on how to get into a HFT trading firm and post on r/quantfinance

Bro you are actually stupid, HFT has existed in India for over a decade, you are the only one who is naive here

First thing first, what jane Street did, it isn't HFT. This is not how HFT works. This is old trick manipulation to make money. I am not saying SEBI did a great job, SEBI failed as usual but it's better late than never.

No, unfortunately, it's all anecdotal evidence from people I've talked to in-person, from places like Optiver, Jane Street, DRW, etc, as well as from seeing real PnL/RoI results from HFT and MM strategies.
HFT arbitrage strategies in particular, are almost riskless, and is a money printing machine in almost every trade they make, This is because they can turn almost any situations that would have been a loss, into breaking even, or even a profit, by just being the first one out and selling it higher than what they buy it for to everyone else who is slower.
One reason could be that HFT and MM institutions usually source money internally, unlike hedge funds who charge a fee to their clients.
That means that while hedge funds will want to do well (to have more clients, to get more performance-based fees, etc), they still get some decent profits from fees even if they underperform, or even go negative (of course, people might start withdrawing). But people putting money into hedge funds are also ok with this, because of the uncorrelated returns part, so underperforming hedge funds persist.
But when funds are sourced internally, if it doesn't beat the market, the owners would close the firm, because they can just buy and hold if that's the case.

After being banned for 3 days (don’t know why) I am back to Reddit. As soon as I opened subs they were flooded with JaneStreet rants. First I thought it must be some stock or some Mutual Fund who looted stock holders and vanished.
When I opened all the comments on the feeds I came to know it was some hedge fund who looted stock “Manipulated” the Indian Market as per SEBI.
So I went deep into the matter and I found out entire scenario what exactly happened.
I feel Jane Street just showed you the glimpse of US stock market. “The High Frequency Trading”.
How and What they did you all know better than me but is really Jane Street a villain here? Adani has been doing this thing since ages. Adani is infamous for trapping retailers and their operator traps so bad that some of the HNIs have stopped trading in Adani. You use fundamentals or Technicals Adani operators are just unpredictable. Forget Adani any stock market is about making money and trapping opposite forces.
Coming back to JaneStreet, our SEBI is so dumb and so backward in following such cases that they realise these kinda trading after 5-6 months. Who kept those loopholes? Who exploited those loopholes? SEBI? If they can’t handle it then why do they even make such awkward situations. It has happened before when Harshad Mehta was booming. It has happened everytime From Dhirubhai Ambani to RJ to Every other HNI in Indian Stock Market. They didn’t even fine Dhirubhai in 1987-90 I don’t exactly remember the year but when Bears were shorting Reliance like anything. When the so called “Friends of Reliance” started buying the shares. They had investigated that exact matter in 2007-08 something in the budget.
Everybody is bashing JanStreet for using their Algos and Money for manipulation. People here are crying for volumes and all nonsense. Come on guys! Have you even bought 18000 quantities of Nifty options in your life? You don’t even know when and how to buy Option and you are crying over JaneStreet?
And I am also not saying JaneStreet is entirely correct. But they have done all they could in their limits. SEBI on other hand is still not understanding what exactly happened. This is their textbook style to punish such players. Nobody is questioning SEBI. SEBI is just a headless chicken.
And just a simple question. If I have so much money that I can change entire OI data from Red to Green or vice versa then what’s wrong with that? Am I here to earn money or think about brainless people losing money?
So if this HFT made you shat your pants then understand you are nowhere near playing in markets, you are nowhere near understanding it.

a random walk down wall street was written in 1973…. there is no winning strategy that a quant hasn’t eliminated but bots have destabilized the system trying to win with HFT which can create flash crashes and a crazy stochastic mess. Good luck value investing where nothing matters.

Exactly, that's my point.
A lot of people incorrectly look at hedge funds' failure to outperform benchmarks as proof that you can't beat the market, because financial institutions with top talent, data, and experience, can't even seem to do that.
It's the most commonly drawn conclusion drawn from the result of Warren Buffett making a bet that an S&P 500 index fund will outperform hedge fund managers over a decade), and what pushes people into index/passive investing.
But that's not true, because HFT and market makers beat the market easily.